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Archos 504 160GB
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Nordburgh 2006-09-29, 10:31 #1
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Subject: Archos 504 160GB
It is mine! And hopefully 7 days later will still be mine after testing.

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RubenNYC 2006-09-29, 14:33 #2
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Congrats, Bro!!!  How's the gapless?  ;-)
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Nordburgh 2006-09-29, 18:41 #3
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I'll have to test it. The display is really bright, really clean. I think this thing has got the iPod crushed in terms of video display quality that's for sure. I've got a 7 day return policy so if it fail gapless or doesn't play an abundance of video formats (XviD with AC3 audio/VBR audio) then it goes back and I guess I break down and pick up an iPod 80GB.

I can confirm it works with Rhapsody To Go so it's passed that test. There is one major freaking flaw in this player. Out of the box it does not come with an AC adapter, it charges via the USB which is outrageous. It should be mandatory that these devices come with an AC adapter. What if I don't have a computer with me and I need to charge it? WTF were they thinking? I can't even buy one yet. They don't have the adapter available. That might make me return it no matter what. We'll have to see how annoying this can be.

EDIT: I plan to test using Chump/Longview since Jaw likes to use this as a test and it's a pretty good one. I'm using EAC to encode which means there will be no nogap tag used I guess since it will be a track by track basis. I had EAC detect gaps before ripping. EAC reports a 0:00:00:03 gap. I will now rip to MP3 using LAME 3.96.1 and will then transfer and test it out. I'll compare it against the CD, not the MP3's I ripped on my computer.

Let you know my findings.
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This post was edited on 2006-09-29, 19:02 by Nordburgh.
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Nordburgh 2006-09-29, 19:52 #4
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NOT GAPLESS NOT EVEN CLOSE. Their claims are patently FALSE. Using firmware version 1.2.05 there is a noticeable gap that shouldn't be there. There is a new firmware 1.2.08 but it only fixes a random update failure but decided to update and try it with this newer firmware.

No dice. I REPEAT NOT GAPLESS. I'd like to try again with the nogap flag but I don't know how I would do this, is there software that supports ripping with this option?

One other glaring annoyance is that if you sync just the audio files to the device using WMP it doesn't put the tracks in track order. They're random. So much for this POS reading ID3 tags.

Also my first video test has failed. The video kinda stuttered. So far this player is looking to be crap. I had such high hopes for this thing. Also the audio output is very low, this thing requires an amp, otherwise sound quality is fine, just too low. I have it maxed out right now on my Grado SR80's.

Alright wait, I tried playing it again and it appears the gap is because it's not pre-buffering. I feel the hard drive reading right around the switch. I wonder if this is because I had to make a playlist on the player to setup the two songs in order because this POS won't put them in properly on the device. Grr. I'll have to see if I can get the files in order naturally without having to resort to a playlist and see if that works.

EDIT: Alright I can browse the hard drive for the music, luckily I still use a good naming convention on the file itself so its in order. I hate waiting. I want to fast foward but don't want to mess with any buffering or stuff so I have to wait wait wait...another minute to go...GAP!!!!!!!!

Yep, claims are false. Looks like this gets returned.

EDIT 2: I sent an email to Archos tech support basically calling them out on this. We will see what they say. Of course their stupid support form doesn't even list the 504 for me to select. Then they require the serial number which I'm not giving them because I'm probably going to return the unit and I can't do that if it's registered.

I'll let you know what they have to say. Their sales dept. was quick to respond when I asked when this player would be out, somehow I don't think tech support will be as fast. Probably have to wait until Monday at the earliest for a response.
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This post was edited on 2006-09-29, 20:17 by Nordburgh.
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luketabor 2006-09-29, 22:53 #5
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That sucks.  Damn dirty liars.
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nudel 2006-09-30, 04:21 #6
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Disappointing. It's like the audio/software engineers at these companies don't even know what gapless playback *is* let alone how to achieve it.
Bit the shed again. Typical.
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RubenNYC 2006-09-30, 12:54 #7
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Thanks for taking the plunge putting it through the wringer.  Utterly disappointing.

Edit: Does this thing support Ogg Vorbis or FLAC?  Does any codec play gapless on the thing?
This post was edited on 2006-09-30, 13:17 by RubenNYC.
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Nordburgh 2006-09-30, 14:03 #8
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No support of Vorbis or FLAC. I think it might support wav, I guess that should playback gapless.

EDIT: And I tried another Green Day combination, Holiday followed by Boulevard Of Broken Dreams. That should not have any gap at all, unless of course you use this device to play it...

So I tried using two different sequences and a gap has appeared both times. I don't know what to make of this player beyond that. I like the 160GB of storage space. I can put all my music on it with plenty of space to boot. The gap on this player is worse than anything I've heard. I really don't understand how they can make the claim this does true gapless.
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This post was edited on 2006-09-30, 14:59 by Nordburgh.
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nudel 2006-09-30, 15:06 #9
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Do you check it has the latest firmware?
Bit the shed again. Typical.
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RubenNYC 2006-09-30, 18:16 #10
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Quote by nudel:
Do you check it has the latest firmware?

The articles I've read on DAPReview.net indicate gapless was added in firmware 1.2.05, which Nordy has tried.  I'll get a link for you in a minute.

EDIT: HERE's the update history on the Archos 404/504/604.

It says, "Audio player is now true gapless" under the improvements included in 1.2.05.
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Nordburgh 2006-09-30, 18:55 #11
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In reply to post #9
And I tried it with the update to 1.2.08, no gapless.
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flattop100 2006-09-30, 23:07 #12
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It says, "Audio player is not true gapless" under the improvements included in 1.2.05.

Fix'd!
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Nordburgh 2006-10-01, 16:23 #13
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Holy crap. I got the biggest BS response you can imagine:
The 504 is not designed to play gapless.  We never claimed that it is.  I'm very sorry if you believed that it would do this.
I bet he's sorry they misled me and countless other people to believe their player supported gapless.

I told them their very own release notes for their firmware makes this claim. I can't wait to see the response. They probably will ignore me which will be a very bad idea.
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n00b 2006-10-01, 17:25 #14
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Oh man, how could they do that?  I think it's better for Apple to claim gapless when it's actuall pseudogapless but it's still gapless but then later disproved by nudel but still disputed than to say gapless and have no gapless at all *GAAAAAASP*, yeah.  Run on sentences for the lose.
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nudel 2006-10-01, 17:39 #15
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The 504 is not designed to play gapless.  We never claimed that it is.

Quote by Archos:
Archos 404 / 504 / 604 Operating System History
[...]
Version 1.2.05
[...]
- Audio player is now true gapless

(http://www.archos.com/support/download/firmware/archos604/… backed-up in case anyone gets revisionist.)

LOL, oh man. This could be quite embarassing for them. There are good things being said about Archos on places like CNet and DAPReview which will need to be corrected, but I guess we should wait to hear back from Archos on WTF is going on with their claims and counter-claims.

It'd be funny if you hadn't just spent a lot of money on one.

Quote by n00b:
I think it's better for Apple to claim gapless when it's actuall pseudogapless but it's still gapless but then later disproved by nudel but still disputed than to say gapless and have no gapless at all
Are you just talking hypothetically? So far I have only positive things to say about the iPod's gaplessness; it's the real deal.

Gah, just read lots more comments on DAPReview about how the iPod supposedly doesn't do gapless right... Some really misinformed stuff being said there about how some players apparently do gapless by divine magic, which is the only true way apparently, while the iPod does it in software which is wrong, because it causes poverty or something. (Even though every single gapless player does it via software. I think that iTunes gapless album tag, which has no relevance at all to playback on the iPod, has really confused some people.)

I must make a DAPReview account so I can post at some point... Not at 1:40am on a Monday, though. Need. Sleep. So much work to do.
Bit the shed again. Typical.
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This post was edited on 2006-10-01, 18:11 by nudel.
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