Vibez substitutes - Riovolution

rick.hughes

2009-03-04, 17:37 #1

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Subject: Vibez substitutes

I would have liked to have flash and more capacity, but my 12GB Vibez is still working, and I have a spare battery in the freezer, so I am in good shape for now.

But since this great player is unavailable and we now know no new models are forthcoming, it would be good if we could share what we find out about alternative DAPs. I've only ever used RIO players, starting with the Nitrus, and I still have a Forge that works. I probably don't know as much about alternatives as others on the board.

To me, the most important feature of the Vibez that is rarely found in other DAPs is Sessions, aka Bookmarks. I switch between my current audiobook, a podcast, and music all the time. Cowon D2 sounds like it might work for this.

Another feature of the Vibez that is just as rare, and frequently requested but it seems never delivered, is gapless playback. I mostly listen to progrock, and gapless is very important to me. From some research I have done it sounds like iPods support this now. Any others?

And then there is Rockbox. I have only begun to look into this. The Rockbox developers seem to be aware how important these rare features are.

What other DAPs give these features that are so important to me?

What Vibez features are important to you but difficult to find elsewhere?

Maybe we could get a list together to help each other decide where to go from here.

Peregrine 2009-03-05, 11:12 #2

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I really like the 4GB Fuse. But it is a poor substitute for a Vibez/Karma.
The only thing it does as good as the Vibez/Karma is sound quality. It is really QUITE good.
I also like how I can change EQ settings while music is playing. That's a nice feature.
But a lack of a NOW PLAYING list, which I assumed every player had by now, really kind of sucks. Never reaized how important that was til I didn't have it anymore.
There are different view options, like a Sound Leveling view, album art view, but when a track switches it goes back to the default track view. Annoying.
I really miss the DJ feature. I would say 70% of the time I would do a PLAY > DJ > RANDOM for an hour more then I was planning to have it on. Then I would skip tracks I didn't want to hear. This would create a recent music DJ setting, so I could listen to the tunes I really enjoyed later. As far as I know, nothing on the planet has something similar. iTunes has the GENUIS feature which is almost the same kind of thing but afaik it does not translate to the players. I miss DJ more then anything. Now I just PLAY ALL > SHUFFLE.
I also miss the ability to view all id3 info on the player.
Sansa sells a line out dock for it, and they just added a SLEEP feature in the last firmware. Nice.
I do like the Fuse. The UI is great. Quick. Pretty. The size is great. Screen is gorgeous. Adore that about it. The wheel is great. Quick and responsive and feels like it will last a long time. I have a 16GB card on the way. I had a $50 gift certificate so TECHNICALLY I paid less then $100 for a super tiny 20GB DAP. ($29 for the Fuse + $49 for a 16GB card). "Untechinically" I paid $130. Still not bad.

I rock a lawsuit when I'm going to court, a white suit when I'm getting divorced
A black suit at the funeral home, and my birthday suit when I'm home alone

epithetless 2009-03-05, 15:05 #3

Member since Sep 2006 · 197 posts · Location: Boston, Mass
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Quote by Peregrine:
But a lack of a NOW PLAYING list, which I assumed every player had by now, really kind of sucks. Never reaized how important that was til I didn't have it anymore.

Peregrine, I do believe the Fuze has a "Now Playing" list, if by another name...On the playback screen, click the submenu (down) button on the wheel and then click on "Back to Music List" (the first entry). This will take you to the place in the Music Browser where the currently-playing track was selected from (either the album or the playlist).

On the topic of the Fuze, I'm actually pretty nonplussed by the GUI...but that's mainly because it's the same one Sandisk's been using on their players for years, ever since the e200 debuted. Some font anti-aliasing and a user-creatable interface (or even backgrounds) would really bump up the player's image, in my view. But most important for Vibez-replacement worthiness -- for me -- would be gapless playback of LAME-encoded MP3s and fully-featured on-the-fly playlisting (create, add to, remove from, rearrange, save, re-edit, rename, etc.). The EQ could use some work as well (by adding parametric functionality and subtracting the degradation of sound quality), but luckily the sound quality on the "Normal" setting is unimpeachable. I'm not too bothered by the less-than-stellar EQ myself, as I rarely use one anyway. But I agree that access to tag info would be a great addition.

So definitely not a Vibez replacement as it stands, but Rockbox (oh, Rockbox) would change all that. I consider my Fuze ownership an investment in the future...a Sigmatel-less future, sadly. :'(

gomtuu 2009-03-05, 15:14 #4

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Quote by epithetless:
But I agree that access to tag info would be a great addition.

Does it not use tags at all, or does it just not show you super-detailed tag info?

Speaking of tags, I seem to remember talk a few years ago about a feature the Karma was supposed to get. I think people were saying that it would support multiple tags of the same type on a song—two artists, for instance—and then you could search by either one of those artists and find the song. I'm pretty sure that didn't make it in. And I doubt it's in any other players, except maybe via Rockbox. Does anybody happen to know anything about that?

epithetless 2009-03-05, 15:45 #5

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Quote by gomtuu:
Does it not use tags at all, or does it just not show you super-detailed tag info?

It actually uses tag-based browsing exclusively, but it doesn't have any sort of "show song info" screen which displays the specifics of a given track (à la the Vibez or Rockbox).

Peregrine 2009-03-05, 18:05 #6

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Ah, OK. There's that now playing list. Thanks.

I rock a lawsuit when I'm going to court, a white suit when I'm getting divorced
A black suit at the funeral home, and my birthday suit when I'm home alone

rapiddescent 2009-03-06, 05:58 #7

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I'm in the same boat - had rio karma and a carbon in the past and now have a slightly faulty Vibez (not fixed yet). I'm a linux user and my music is encoded as ogg vorbis - music quality is key for me - not interested in playing movies etc. I love the rio/sigmatel software, especially gapless, rio DJ and so on.

so what's next? I nearly clicked on BUY NOW for a Cowon d2 just to have as a holding pattern until a new sigmatel inspired platform comes out - but then I noticed that rockbox was not finished yet for the D2 so thought I would go for a rockbox supported platform. haven't made a decision yet but willing to buy a few and try them out before settling on something.

it still seems a shame because I just can't understand why the Karma failed - even today, it is technically better than a lot of the DAPs out there.

rxxdoc 2009-03-09, 17:59 #8

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The NEW Cowon D2+

Yes "+" as in better sound.

Can't imagine how they can make the D2 any better. I would have bought a Trekstor Vibez F if the HD version of the player was not such a POS. Sorry, great sounding player, but really bad quality. I just wish I could convert my HD version to a flash version. I would figure out how to do it myself.

When my other players go south, I will buy a new Cowon. And the worst part is how much I wanted to like the Trekstor Vibez.

My current Vibez still plays, anyone want to buy it?

epithetless 2009-03-09, 23:25 #9

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Quote by rxxdoc:
The NEW Cowon D2+

Yes "+" as in better sound.

I assume you mean the sound is improved when using the updated BBE+ software vs. the D2's original BBE software? From what I've read, there weren't expected to be any internal hardware revisions made in the D2+ (apart from DAB support for the countries that broadcast it).

Slapshot 2009-03-10, 11:21 #10

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So I've been looking at the D2 (assume the overall functionality is the same as the +), but I'm wondering if anyone can help with a couple questions:

1) Playlists. The more research I do on this, the more confused I get. Bottom line, does the D2 allow on-the-fly playlists and can you transfer playlists from PC to the unit without a bunch of gyrations?

2) Does the unit seamlessly integrate the SD card with the on board Flash? What I mean is: do I need to keep the music/video separate on each or does the unit recognize that "Track 1" is on the Flash Drive so it doesn't transfer it twice to the SD card? I had an Insignia that was unable to distinguish so I had to manage the memory separate (PITA).

3) Any feedback on the Jet Audio software? It sounds like it works well but not sure. Would prefer to get an opinion from like-minded folks.

At this point, I'm debating between the S9 and D2. I have an iPod Touch now and can't deal with the sound quality and lack of features any longer. Still have a couple Karma's but they're just limping along.

occams_razor 2009-03-10, 20:51 #11

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@Slapshot: I've been wondering the same things about the D2 playlisting. It just hasn't been explicitly mentioned in any reviews or threads I've visited (I've only seriously started researching the D2 this week).

Also I've been thinking about the S9 which looks fantastic, but unfortunately doesn't feature expandable memory. Though that may not be a factor if/when they release a 32GB version.

CardMaster 2009-04-13, 18:03 #12

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I was waiting for that vibez, I was figurine that my Rio Karma was about to die soon or later.
I did try the Samsung YPQ1. It not a bad player, I keep it for my job to sell paradigm speaker.
But I not happy with tree thing, navigation, no DJ option and the fact that the input is not strong at all.....
It is ok if you have a Seneisher PX 100 or a CX300, but it lack power a lot if you plus a HD 555.....
Anyway I did paid 130 with that player and it do the job for Selling Speaker of 300$, 500$, 1000$, 2000$ and more.
God I love OGG. THe player did paid it self in two month and something!

My mini Jack on my Karma is now not fonctionning at all, or more a very small shock and a lose the sound. Hope Jim Thomson will help me agains.

I decided to try the S9 of cowon, if it don't work I will sell it a my job and repair buy a other karma.
ANyway I will post a Report on that player....

Peregrine 2009-04-14, 07:20 #13

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I like the Fuze. Sincerely. But can you tell I REALLY miss my RIO DJ/DJ?

http://forums.sandisk.com/sansa/board/mess…?board.id=fea…

I rock a lawsuit when I'm going to court, a white suit when I'm getting divorced
A black suit at the funeral home, and my birthday suit when I'm home alone

krazykit (Administrator) 2009-04-16, 03:46 #14

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Quote by Peregrine on 2009-04-14, 07:20:
I like the Fuze. Sincerely. But can you tell I REALLY miss my RIO DJ/DJ?

http://forums.sandisk.com/sansa/board/mess…?board.id=fea…

The Sandisk firmware is getting surprising feature updates, but it's still ugly. The Fuze won't be woth it until Rockbox works, IMO

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epithetless 2009-04-16, 11:19 #15

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Quote by krazykit:
Quote by Peregrine on 2009-04-14, 07:20:
I like the Fuze. Sincerely. But can you tell I REALLY miss my RIO DJ/DJ?

http://forums.sandisk.com/sansa/board/mess…?board.id=fea…

The Sandisk firmware is getting surprising feature updates, but it's still ugly. The Fuze won't be woth it until Rockbox works, IMO

I completely agree, kk.